Otters

[CarponlineEditor]

Did anyonw see the article in Carpworld about the re-introduction of otters into all our rivers. Apparently the europeans are making this law so that otters have to be re-introduced but what will this mean to our fisheries? Will the owners of our fisheries be able to make their waters otter proof? Does this mean the end of angling as we know it?

[scorpio]

I can't see Otters making a noticed impact on our sport, cormarents and mink have been decimating the sport for years but we all still catch. I think that otters are just another proof of the improvment in the quality of our waterways. Don't knock it, enjoy it

[scorpio]

mmm, I never realised that otters were the foxes of the water, Ian do you have to let otters into your waters if you own them? Surely you have the last say, if these animals are going to kill large carp it is going to affect the business of RMC and as RMC own the land and lakes is it not down to them? I know Cormerants are wild birds and mink are a pain but these cannot be controlled, well the cormerants anyway but if otters are going to be introduced surely the owners of the waters involved can prevent this.

Now there is the problem of distribution as the otters will obviously roam, I would shoot any such animal on my land if it was going to affect my livelyhood... would this be illegal?

[CarponlineEditor]

I have a feeling that if the otters were introduced back into the wild by law then it would probably be ilegal to shoot them or come to that kill them in any way.

As to not allowing them into your waters, I suggest that putting signs up saying "Otters not allowed" would not be of much use. I suspect that introducing Otters into our flowing waterways would mean that any stillwater near to a river would be at threat. Also as Ian says, otters do not seem to jusy kill to eat, they would possibly kill for sport and as carp would be an easy prey there would be a big percentage that would be finished off. It may even mean that the only carp in stillwaters affected that were left would be smaller ones that could hide in amongst the undergrowth and weeds. Their bigger bretheren wouldnt stand much chance of out swimming an otter.

[Neil]

If this does go ahead and otters are reintroduced on a large scale it will be a learning experience for everyone!
I do think that introducing hand reared, tame predators to the countryside is not the right way to go about it (could you imagine what farmers would say if this was done with wolves). Surely conservation areas could be cordened off for them to breed undisturbed. Then if they were trapped and introduced to other areas they would stay clear of humans and this would apply to fisheries. A lot of people don't realise that otters are members of the weasel family and as such will hunt and kill prey even when they are not hungry.
<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Neil on 27/11/00 04:13 PM.</FONT></P>

[scorpio]

If I owned a water and I paid a lot of money for my fish I would shoot them. I just think sometimes these conservasionists go too far, look what happened when they released the mink, okay, I don't think an animal should be bred for it's fur but that's another story, as for the Otters if they are as destructive as what Ian says they should be disposed of, I can imagine it, a few animal lovers sitting on a river bank " Oh sweetie, look the Otter has caught a 40lb carp, what a clever little otter he is" No mention that the Carp is probably older than them and will give a lot of people a lot of pleasure long after these air heads have got bored with the cute little otters.

Sorry people but I think any otter found near any prolific fishery should be shot or taken up to Prince Charles's Salmon grounds.

[Billyo]

It's not only carp they have ! That was just an example as this species of fish is more valuable than most...

Bill.

[scorpio]

But carp are and otters are not. There are a lot of things that are not meant to be here but what are we going to do, introduce predators to decimate them? I think not!!!

[bazza]

are we on the fast show? you know, the bloke in the pub who agrees with everyone...! made me laugh out loud! it could almost be surreal...hahaha!

not for the content, i should add - hardly a laughing matter as anyone who has seen or read about the carnage these (very efficient) predators have wreaked on some fisheries.

[PaulG]

Hmmm......playing the devil's advocate here.......isn't this another sign of man's impact on the natural environment, triggered by his own selfishness ? Just because we want to catch fish, then everything else which could have a detrimental impact on this must be excluded. Makes for a bit of hyprocrisy when anglers talk about their close links with nature when they go fishing.....as long as it is completely controlled by man......confusing or what ? Another thought, being realistic, there isn't going to be a population explosion of otters, we're not talking tribes of them wiping out pits, their natural behaviour will limit that as will the environment that people are trying to introduce them. Didn't one area where they were trying to re-introduce otters have to be abandoned as all those released got run over by cars ? Yateley for example, isn't exactly a traffic free area is it ?

BTW - This isn't necessarily my own viewpoint, just thought I'd add another aspect to the discussion :-)

Regards, Paul

[CarponlineEditor]

I have heard that there will now be no more otters being introduced into the wild. I am not sure why but it was in one of the papers.

[rhornegold]

Four years ago a group of us fishing Fields Weir saw two otters playing under some trees.
These were the first ones I have seen since the 50s,I can appreiate the fears of fishery owners, but surely the biggest treat to fishery stocks comes from cormorants.
It is possible to count as many as 50 cormorants perched on the railings at Feilds weir where silver &fry fish are a thing of the past.
If angling can do nothing about cormorants I dont think there is anything we can do about otters except support NASA/SACG who fight on our behalf.

Bob Hornegold

[CarponlineEditor]

Bob, I think the only reason people got a bit worried about the otters was the fact that Carpworld published pictures of carp over twenty pounds that had been partly eaten by the otters. I agree there is not much we can do about them even if we did try but cormorants even though they are a terrible thing as far as say roach and smaller fish are concerned do not eat twenty pound carp. Well not unless there are some pretty big ones around nowadays lol which I wouldnt be suprised at actually now Ive seen the radioactive seagulls down the coast. lol My girlfriend who lives down there assures me they arent radioactive but they are much much bigger than the ones round here so I'm not so sure. lol

[rhornegold]

Not every organisation is as forward thinking as RMC, as far as I know all species start of as fry be it roach or carp.
Walthamstow reservior only stock trout above 3lb because of the decimation by cormorants.
Sure it's a problem if a twenty pound carp gets eaten by an otter, but in my opinion not nearly as bad as the cormorants and cray fish situation.

Bob Hornegold

[CarponlineEditor]

I agree wholeheartedly that cormorants are a real problem on a lot of waters. In Bushy park for example it is an odd sight to see three or four of these large birds cruising up and down the lakes in a line fishing but the thread was about otters and that is why I was mentioning the fact that I thought it was good that introduction of otters into the wild had been halted for at least the timebeing. Maybe a different thread about the cormorants would be a good idea. I have heard that one of the bodies that control this sort of thing had mentioned the pricking of their eggs such as is going to happen to the Canadian geese. Do you think that may help with the problem. That is cormorants eggs not otters eggs lol

[Billyo]

Hi Bob,

I know that Walthamstow has suffered badly from the cormorant problem, which may be the reason behind them stocking large fish...

I used to have many days catching VERY DECENT roach a while back, but these days are now gone ! The old coppermill used to be wonderful only a few years back !!

ATB,

Bill.

[jimshelley]

hi,
saw one in the ouse the other day behind fen,not good.terry also saw it aswell.
jim shelley
keeping it british.